However, when coasting on rough terrain the unloaded system can exhibit a 'NORMAL' clicking sound that may be detectable to the rider. I would have respected Shimano more if they owned it and were more forthright about working to resolve it. Animals and Pets Anime Art Cars and Motor Vehicles Crafts and DIY Culture, Race, and Ethnicity Ethics and Philosophy Fashion Food and Drink History Hobbies Law Learning and Education Military Movies Music Place Podcasts and Streamers Politics Programming Reading, Writing, and Literature Religion and Spirituality Science Tabletop Games . The existing Shimano E8000 motor is arguably the most popular motor in mountain e-bikes. You've been subscribed to our newsletter. Der Shimano EP8 ist kleiner und leichter Nicht nur das Motorgehuse ist kleiner, auch das Innenleben des EP8 Motors. Please, It appears you're using an old version of Internet Explorer which is, the 471.5mm rear centre on the Giant Trance X E+, that achieves the most discreet integration, the MasterMind TCU display on the new Specialized Levo. That said, wed prefer if there were more metrics displayed on the main screen to begin with, so you could ditch the GPS altogether. Rattling and lack of update to the battery monitoring is a no go for me, I would just upgrade the battery to the new 620s if i could fit it. Once again still want to know; is the BB replaceable on these units yet, or are they still landfill waiting to happen? That Shimano response was pure gold. e*thirteen recommends inspecting Shimano EP8 motor spindles to ensure no cracks are present before riding any EP8 equipped bike again and in doing so have provided a step by step process for doing this with images and instructions below. You can't imagine what kind of thought must have gone behind that response? Shimanos answers to our questions are published below verbatim. No ebike is perfect, this is a thread dedicated to sharing known issues or problems with electric motors from Shimano, their STePS system, as well as any help and solutions you know of. While there were limited options to tweak the levels of the old E8000 and E7000 motors, EP8 takes it to the next level, allowing riders to alter the motors torque, acceleration and general on-trail character, resulting in a more personalised experience for dialling your e-MTB in for your riding style and terrain. And with brands such as Merida and Canyon making use of internal wiring through the handlebars, the whole arrangement is quite tidy. 20ft into my ride and the motor cut out. I suppose pedal assist allows you to tackle the more fun/steep/tech climbs but to be effective it needs to be subtle too. this dude knows how to write a review, well done. The Shimano EP8 RS of the Orbea Rise does not present physical differences concerning the EP8 that we can see mounted on other e-mtb's. Its dimensions and weight are the same. All the grit is gone because it's clearly stuck between your bitter little arse cheeks.. Shimano says it provides up to 350-percent support (in Boost mode versus the E8000's 300 percent). Shimano advises that only approved crank arms should be used with its DU-EP8 drive units, reads Shimanos statement. Ebikes are great as a self shuttle, especially for time limited people. Seeing if anyone else out there has had problems with their EP8. No, not at all. Wowzers! SpecializEd # levo SL is a great benchmark Have had a Specialized Levo & sold it due to making weird noises, so yes other manufacturers have problems too, not saying that is easy to get good reliability with new technology, but my Shimano e-8000 motor has been more reliable even is very wet weather! I have not heard of a recall, so I did some digging. Posted Oct 21, 2020. If you are disabled and need a motor on your bike in order to ride, I understand. 2a - Using a 5mm hex key, loosen counterclockwise and remove the preload cap. You can improve efficiency by limiting the maximum torque, though it is still possible to get maximum power out of the motor by pedalling at a higher cadence, so you wont necessarily get more range by limiting torque. On my e8000, my impression was (now on a Trek Rail w a Bosch gen 4) that if you were at two bars, you were really at one, and if you were at one, youd better be a couple of blocks from home. This will be a far more accurate method for determining your estimated range. As much as I want an emtb right now, I am waiting until the technology is perfected. But to give you some numbers, weve consistently achieved around 1,500m of climbing during our 30-50km test rides. He was pretty happy about ANT compatibility. Their new ride algorithms make the EP8 one of the most natural feeling motors out there, with plenty of power to propel the bike over obstacles, even if Bosch and Brose are still a bit punchier and deliver slightly more power. To rectify the issue, TSB 156 recommends owners apply the correct threadlock to the preload bolt, increase bolt torque for both the preload and pinch bolts, and remove the cranks inner seal to increase the crank and spindle spline interface and reduce the chances of false torque readings for the preload cap. Another bike that features Shimano EP8 is the new Orbea Rise. They could have gone "yeah the rattling sucks but we hope you appreciate the motor nonetheless" but instead they composed this pure poetry. So then it gets really confusing as it seems like the first bar lasts 30% and the last one 10%. So many issues that can be simply solved by not having a motor. Despite the musclier performance, weve had excellent results in terms of range, with the Bosch motor regularly achieving more miles and elevation over EP8. It features the new Shimano EP8 motor and a 630wh battery. So that would include rocks, hops, trackstands but also sudden boosts from a standstill. Recalled but still was delivered with the rattle. Under this condition, with each ride the crack can expand, and this can result in a spindle breakage.. That's worse to, because 20kg dead weight doesn't contribute like 20kg of normal, muscle-laden body mass. Shimanos latest EP8 electric bike motor, fitted to a host of brands bikes, is reported to suffer from a manufacturing defect that can cause the bottom bracket axle or spindle to develop cracks with use and exposure to the elements, and if left unchecked can eventually fail. Uh oh, another one E-triggered. Shimano has put its long-running Steps E8000 format to pastor and heralds in its EP8 motor unit for 2021. @tomdesoals: Ah, thanks I get it. Oh man, so that must mean you know of rigs they've received that they've not done first rides and then field tests on. If youve experienced a Shimano EP8 bottom bracket spindle failure, let us know in the comments below. there are no additional ports on the SC-E5003 to connect the switch with. And you can take the motor together with a battery out in matter of seconds. Side-by-side, the EP8 motor is slimmer around the belly and so offers a skerrick more ground clearance. It's really, really quite quiet. It even surpasses them in terms of noise (very quiet under load) and weight. Specialized is close to this. While the EP8s performance on the climbs is generally excellent, we have occasionally wished for a little more overrun for clearing technical features. Most brains will be capable of doing this, as the noise in question isnt actually signalling a fault with the motor. The EP8 RS engine is physically the same as the . The touch points are all up to typical Shimano standards of quality, though we would like to see improvements to the functionality of the display unit, notably having battery life shown as a percentage. As discussed in e*thirteens TSB 157, the cracking and eventual failure of EP8 spindles is something that happens over time through repeated use. If consumers use the recommended cranks, there should not be any issue this combination meets our strict and exacting quality standards. Does Shimano know why the spindles are snapping? How stuff like this gets through what I would like to think was extensive testing I will never know. I found this beauty as an example: The reviewer weighs 55kgs. Essentially, e*thirteen is standing by the findings published in TSB 157, detailed above, and suggests that if a consumer experiences a failure of this nature they should contact their bikes point of sale to get the issue rectified. Shimano also claims this issue is. There is zero stickiness at the pedals that we could detect. What's left is just a plain old mountain bike with a weight around 14kg. Where the EP8 motorisnt quieter than its predecessor however, is when youre not pedalling. If possible, repeat this ride on the Eco and Boost modes too. When the motor applies torque it pushes in one direction and closes the gap, when there is no torque the ring can rock a little. Can't see the equivalent of a ribbed chainstay protector happening. This speed may be enough, but some people may find it very frustrating because from 25 km/h they have to make a gigantic effort to follow their teammates since the assistance is cut off or simply because they want to go faster. the rattle it because the sprag bearing that used to be used in most motors has been replaced by DT swiss style star ratchet drive rings. I also have a YT Decoy with Shimano E8000 motor. Anyone having problems with the charger? Instead, we recommend setting aside some time for a battery-drainer test ride, somewhere that is accessible and easy to ride out with a flat battery, in order to work out your maximum range you can get during typical riding conditions. I'm honestly flabbergasted that people complain about it tbh lol. I chose this bike because it has the EP8 and from research, seems to be the most reliable platform out there, assuming it's as reliable as the E8000. I've never heard the rattling noise that has been posted in the early reviews - the motor is super quiet, so it looks to me like much ado about nothing. In comparison, the MasterMind TCU display on the new Specialized Levo offers a significantly more customisable and overall user-friendly experience. This allows bike companies to engineer a single frame, while offering cheaper models with a 504Wh battery, and high-end models with a 630Wh battery. Currently, I own two e-bikes with a new 2022 Moustache Samedi 26 Fat 4 with the Bosch Motor on its way. Those Merida ebikes ride quite good too. Now well point out here that the Bosch Gen 4 motor exhibits a similar metallic clacking noise, since its internal gear system also employs a clutch. These combinations meet our strict and exacting quality standards. Aim for a cadence between 70-90 RPM for maximum efficiency and response from the motor. The fact that the EP8 motor uses the same mounting points as the old E8000 motor means there are a few bikes out there that were anticipating will be updated with the new motor like the Norco Sight VLT and Range VLT. "but since I have to hit the small button repeatedly when my battery charge becomes critical on some rides". Couldn't agree more. Wait until you see how much work it takes to replace rear derailleur housing! From what I get from the article, what would actually bother me more is how it kicks in from a standstill or trackstand. You can't call an e-bike rider lazy when they try to overtake you making this sound. As mentioned above, the Assistance Character bears the biggest influence on the motors on-trail feel, and dialling this down can make quite a big difference to the amount of range you can get from the battery. In the lower settings, youll have to pedal really hard to get maximum support the motor. It doesn't feel good. But overall EP8 offers more of a quieter and gentler hum than the whine of the E8000 motor, and its also quieter than the Bosch motor too. An E-bike with 200 watt power assist, 350 WH battery, and total weight of bike under 34 lbs. I find the author of this article is overly picky. If a dynamo can be worked into the wheel hubs, you may even get near perpetual charging while the system is in use. If thats the case for you, start at Level 5 and work your way down a notch at a time. 3. I was sure it was a motor issue till I realized I needed to put the speed sensor on the new wheel. Im the worlds biggest ebike fan & I quite agree. Lapierre e-zesty. That rattle would drive me bonkers. And more power requires more juice. You still have the three basic assist modes: Eco, Trail and Boost. Shimanos overarching advice is for consumers to only use Shimano-approved pedal cranks on its EP8 motors. The version I've been riding on was 17,8kg. Still, that clutch design means it is impressively drag-free beyond the cutoff point. Ive only charged 2x. Sign in to manage your newsletter preferences. Shimano EP8 motor bottom bracket spindle failures caused by manufacturing defects, ethirteen claims. Alex is also a dedicated eMTB rider, and still dabbles in racing of a sort, doing his best to top the Strava leaderboard on the steepest, gnarliest and twistiest trails the Tweed Valley has to offer just for fun, of course. Can someone make a bike with 50% - 100% assist? Have had my Norco Range LVT with the EP8 for a week and have noticed the noise, maybe once? The downside for Bosch is that its display options leave a lot to be desired. JavaScript is disabled. That rattling feeling comes from one way bearing. If in doubt about such components, we recommend speaking to your bicycle manufacturer.. Why don't they buy dirtbikes instead ? Its worth noting that Bosch motor is only compatible with Bosch battery options though. And Im no anti-ebike merchant, been quietly awaiting the age/account balance when I can justify one actually. What ever happened to grit?!?! it's been quite awhile and still no fix . Shimano get your shit together or just say that you're not going to find a fix. For commercial info: info@eplus.bike. What this article says to me is no wonder people make fun of mountain bikers. So far so good. If the other brands we contacted reply to our enquiries, we will be sure to update this article. These motors have Cadence sensors as well as torque sensors. We will have them soon available in all our subsidiaries (Canada, USA, Chile, Australia, NZ and Reunion Island) to reach all our customers worldwide.. Bikers Edge in Kaysville Utah hooked it up and took a motor off their demo heckler mx and put it on mine. I've already posted this on the Commencal Meta SX Power thread, but wondered if other bikes with the Shimano EP8 motor and battery have seen a similar problem. Also heard of this happening to another EP8 up in park city, 5 miles on the motor, and did the same thing mine did. Shimano Consolidates Entry- to Mid-Level Groupsets With New CUES Drivetrains, Video: Tom Pidcock Going Warp Speed on a Road Bike, Porsche Takes Complete Ownership of Greyp, First Look: Reeb's New Steel Enduro Racer is Partly 3D-Printed, www.gumtree.com.au/s-ad/wanneroo/bicycle-parts-and-accessories/men-s-petrol-bike-mountain-bike-/1259285475, www.cyclevolta.com/story/ebike-components/hold-up-shimanos-new-emtb-motor, www.avdweb.nl/solar-bike/solarbike/maxun-solar-bike. Rattling noise, you've seen (or heard) any of the Semenuk RAW100 videos? I have this motor. The DIODE has the Shimano E8000 motor and both bikes regardless of motor specs and differences do one thing really, really wellthey make riding FUN! I have no personal experience riding with pedal assist but when I hear the high whiz from the motor I think that would drive me mad too. When youre descending down the trail, the volume and resonance are amplified. While weve certainly been impressed by the power, ride feel and tuneability of the Shimano EP8 system, how does it stack up against the likes of Bosch and Brose/Specialized? The brand told us it was aware of the spindle issue and has been in contact with both Shimano and e*thirteen about it. Sell it to me, bet ya cant specially at a respectable 90 keys. The Shimano EP8 user interface is similarly elegant in its design. You miss that obscure offering from Specialized? Hes one of BikeRadars lead testers and knows how to push bikes and products to the limit, searching out the equipment that represents the best value for money. Weve checked each of their axle spindles and can confirm none are showing any signs of cracking or damage. Others will tell us the EP8 is a weaker motor. Don't all e-bikes feature walk assist? This means its impossible to tell whether you have 21% or 49% battery remaining. You also need a special key to release the battery from the frame, which were not fans of, at least for a mountain bike anyway. Easy fix. We suspect the amount of riding required to replicate this problem far exceeds the number of kilometres an average bike tester will do on any given model. Approved crank arms are listed at si.shimano.com and are communicated towards bicycle manufacturers. The Bosch motor produces the same 85Nm peak torque output as Shimano EP8, and it offers a similarly drag-free ride quality beyond the 25km/h cutoff due to the motor decoupling from the cranks. me-bikes: Ibis Exie, Ibis Ripley V4, Ibis Ripmo V2. All e-Bike assist mode gets disabled during the downhill slopes. However, where the Bosch Gen 4 feels like a diesel engine at low RPMs, the sporty EP8 drive unit still prefers spinning at a higher cadence. The lowest setting sees the motor responding slower to your pedalling inputs. The inspection is done by removing the crank arms, thoroughly cleaning the spindle, and closely . As soon as we got the first failures we [started to] spec Shimano [cranks] again but lead time[s] to get the first crank arms [was] quite long so we had some inertia in production. Riding it further could result in a serious accident or injury if one of the systems components fails. Now, we're not going to be working on the actual. The sign of a true technical rider. The EM800 display features built-in Bluetooth and ANT+ wireless connectivity for pairing both your phone and a compatible GPS head unit, allowing you to display information such as battery life and remaining range. On top of that, you cant tune the Bosch motor like you can with EP8 theres no fancy app, and the stock assist settings arent adjustable what you see is what you get. If speed and maximum power output is less of a concern though, switching into the factory Eco mode is a sure-fire way to get more ride time expect range to double from those figures above. Unfortunately this clutch also produces a metallic clack whenever it rotates back and fourth. Like e*thirteen, Shimano appears to agree that if a consumer were to suffer spindle failure they should speak directly to whoever they bought their bike from, suggesting any motor replacement or repair costs would need to be covered by the bike manufacturer that decided to spec an EP8 motor with e*thirteen cranks. There's 21-percent more torque (85 N/m total) in Trail and Boost modes. Yeah but who needs all that power? The only Shimano-approved pedal cranks listed on Shimanos website are the FC-EM600, FC-M8150 and FC-EM900, all of which are available to buy aftermarket from various retailers. With the new EP8, Shimano managed to close the gap to its biggest competitors. 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